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what is considered rust??
#1
I found this ad on craigs list. Please explain to me what is considered rust on a car?
http://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/5375334404.html
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#2
Yup that's rust.

- Mike
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#3
Hi Alex,

The seller is obviously referring to his rust as rust that has eaten all the way through the steel, leaving gaping holes. But of course, he's way wrong ignoring all the other surface rust around the car. In that sense he should have been much more specific in his description of the rust around the car when talking about it. Surface rust is bad news, especially when badly eaten into the steel.

So what is that? Denial and /or trying to downplay the reality of the condition of the car to help sell it on for the best price.Tongue Either way, you have to laugh.Big Grin

Greg.Smile

whistling LORD, MR FORD - JERRY REED
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#4
Yup, Austin has it pretty much stated, but the pics show the tip of the iceberg so to speak. Underside structural is most likely compromised by rust thru in a number of areas as evidenced by the amount seen topside. Probably a result of years of sitting in the open with standing water inside doors, wheel wells, etc. If it's a native NJ vehicle, then it saw lots of salt in its first decade on the roads.

Kind of a shame since I'm a fan of these year Torino convertibles.
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#5
I am curious of the statements given in certain ads. What is considered rust free?
rust cut away and replaced?
rust sanded off and primed?
What do you guy consider the scaly rust on floor pans and frame rails? If its rust, can I sand it off and be rust free/
let me know & Merry Christmas!
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#6
That is a broad term for some. A friend rebuilt a 69 Camaro RS, SS convertible for a guy and all that was used was the cowl, windshield frame with the door hinge posts. I think maybe the rear seat piece between the wheel wells and the remainder of the car was replaced with donor or new parts. He can now tell everyone it is now rust free, lol.
Surface rust does not bother me just put in the molasses and it is gone in a couple weeks. Hey the car will last longer than most of us so not going to be too worried.
David


When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??
Tongue
David
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#7
The actual extent of the rust on a "rust free" car will depend on the scruples and moral character of the seller. Low lifes will cover or hide the rust, honest people will tell you the way it is, with a wide range between the two. Buyer beware.



“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”
--Albert Einstein
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#8
waterlife;249983 Wrote:I am curious of the statements given in certain ads. What is considered rust free?
rust cut away and replaced?
rust sanded off and primed?
What do you guy consider the scaly rust on floor pans and frame rails? If its rust, can I sand it off and be rust free/
let me know & Merry Christmas!

Alex,

In the TRUE use of the term "rust free", that's what it means - zero rust present anywhere on the vehicle. If any rust has been present in any car, and has been correctly and properly and fully removed, then the car can be truely called rust free.

But in reference to what you are saying above about scaly rust on floor pans and frame rails, and sanding it off, then that needs some explaining.
Here's the problem. When rust attacks metal, it penetrates into the metal, depending on how advanced the rust is. That's the problem, because to remove ALL traces of the rust, you have to go into the steel and get it all out. How deep you go depends on how advanced the rust is, and how much it has penetrated into the steel. For example, i have worked on many cars over the years, that had bad, advanced surface rust on the panels. This surface rust was in some cases, so bad, that it had eaten deeply into the steel, and the steel then was badly pitted with the rust. To try and remove this rust, sand blasting was the only method to go with to try and get it all out. Disc sanding alone would not have done the job needed. Assuming then that the sand blasting didn't distort the sheet metal, and you got all the rust out, then fillers would still have to be used to back fill in all the bad pitting of the steel. Not a good way to go really. New panels would be a better option in these type of cases.

When repairers attempt to remove rust from steel,they will choose different methods to try and get it out. Such as disc sanding, stone grinding, sand blasting etc, etc. BUT, what ever method you choose, if you don't COMPLETELY remove it all, you will have ongoing rust issues, and in that case, you can't call your car truely rust free, because there is still rust present in your vehicle, even though you tried to get it all out. A lot of people try and remove as much rust as they can from the steel, but sadly, there will be traces of it still present that they missed. When rust has penetrated deep enough into the steel, it is more wise to replace the corroded section of steel with new steel, than to attempt to remove all rust from the corroded section, as you will never be able to remove all the rust from the steel successfully.

When a seller is selling a car that had rust present, but claims that ALL rust has been removed and is now truely rust free, then you are at the seller's mercy. It is very, very hard, almost impossible, to prove that any traces of rust would still be present in the car. You really have to take his or her word for it, that the car had ALL rust completely removed, and is truely rust free, and prey that you won't get any rust issues occurring down the track for you. Repairers, will choose to use rust converters, and paints like epoxy primers to stop any ongoing rust issues from occurring again, but if you didn't completely remove all traces of rust from the steel, then in reality, you don't have a rust free car.

A car buyer can be lucky enough to buy a car that has been so well looked after and cared for and protected, that there is really no rust present on the car to start off with. These cars do exist, but the general rule will be to expect some form of rusting (mild to wild) happening on the car your buying. The trick is obviously to end up buying a car with the smallest amount of rust present on the vehicle.

Here is a bit of technical blurb i pulled off the net on rust. You may find it helpful and interesting.



.png   Ashampoo_Snap_2015.12.28_07h36m31s_001_.png (Size: 20.24 KB / Downloads: 40)

­R­ust is the common name for a very common compound, iron oxide. Iron oxide, the chemical Fe2O3, is common because iron combines very readily with oxygen -- so readily, in fact, that pure iron is only rarely found in nature. Iron (or steel) rusting is an example of corrosion -- an electrochemical process involving an anode (a piece of metal that readily gives up electrons), an electrolyte (a liquid that helps electrons move) and a cathode (a piece of metal that readily accepts electrons). When a piece of metal corrodes, the electrolyte helps provide oxygen to the anode. As oxygen combines with the metal, electrons are liberated. When they flow through the electrolyte to the cathode, the metal of the anode disappears, swept away by the electrical flow or converted into metal cations in a form such as rust.

­For iron to become iron oxide, three things are required: iron, water and oxygen. Here's what happens when the three get together:

When a drop of water hits an iron object, two things begin to happen almost immediately. First, the water, a good electrolyte, combines with carbon dioxide in the air to form a weak carbonic acid, an even better electrolyte. As the acid is formed and the iron dissolved, some of the water will begin to break down into its component pieces -- hydrogen and oxygen. The free oxygen and dissolved iron bond into iron oxide, in the process freeing electrons. The electrons liberated from the anode portion of the iron flow to the cathode, which may be a piece of a metal less electrically reactive than iron, or another point on the piece of iron itself.

The chemical compounds found in liquids like acid rain, seawater and the salt-loaded spray from snow-belt roads make them better electrolytes than pure water, allowing their presence to speed the process of rusting on iron and other forms of corrosion on other metals.

Hope all that helps,

Greg.Smile

whistling LORD, MR FORD - JERRY REED
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