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To 5-speed or not to 5-speed - that is the question
#1
On the 71 Mach 1 I'm seriously considering buying from a relative (see my intro post here), that has a broken auto trans, I'm considering a 5-speed swap.

I have in my garage a Tremec 3550 with a scattershield. This was planned for my 65 (302 4-V), but I think it would be more fun in the new to me Mach 1. What all would I need?...new clutch & brake pedal with support?, cable or hydraulic system?, new crossmember?, new driveshaft? What am I missing?

A few years ago I purchased Mustang Steve items to convert the 65 to his cable clutch setup. I never installed it due to Hurricane Katrina and it flooding my house with the 65 in the garage...but that's another story.

So put the 5-speed in the Mach 1 or the 65 convertible? Pros & cons? Both cars don't are with out their transmissions at this point so it's basically the same starting point for either car.

[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
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#2
Check this out

http://www.mustangdepot.com/OnLineCatalo...ersion.htm
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#3
You just need the clutch peddle and you can now get them new at moderndriveline.
The clutch peddle will bolt into the existing a/t brake bracket. You can also just cut down the
existing brake peddle so a smaller pad fits. I went with a clutch cable also from moderndriveline. But if you want long tube headers, you may want a hydraulic setup for clearance, (from what i've read. I still have the stock manifold). I have the TKO-500 which is the current version of the 3550. You will need a longer drive shaft and a different x-member.
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#4
1971mach1;12093 Wrote:You just need the clutch peddle and you can now get them new at moderndriveline.
The clutch peddle will bolt into the existing a/t brake bracket. You can also just cut down the
existing brake peddle so a smaller pad fits. I went with a clutch cable also from moderndriveline. But if you want long tube headers, you may want a hydraulic setup for clearance, (from what i've read. I still have the stock manifold). I have the TKO-500 which is the current version of the 3550. You will need a longer drive shaft and a different x-member.

i too have the moderndriveline set up from my c6 to a TKO600 swap. however with the pedal ordeal, its a toss up if the clutch pedal hanger is there or not. they claim some cars do and some cars don't. in my case i didn't have it. instead of buying the pedal i found a whole set up on ebay for a good price.

there is an alternative however if you don't have the right hanger, you can send in your clutch pedal bracket and have mustang steve weld you in some rollerized wheel bearings in there. and of course cut down your automatic pedal.
if you want to wait, GREG at www.americanpowertrain.com has roy's pedals so he can REPOP them up. i however did posted there is a difference between a power and a manual brake pedal. the attachment point is at a different location.
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#5
Thanks for the info. Were most of the non-Boss 351 Mach1s automatics?

[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
  Reply
#6
Don65Stang;12141 Wrote:Thanks for the info. Were most of the non-Boss 351 Mach1s automatics?


not sure about that but hell, when i got into a fender bender before i joined the military over 7 years ago i drove across california to find a junkyard 73 mustang for fenders, front bumper, bumper brackets, headlight bucket and most other front end stuff. the car had a 250 6cyl in it and the clutch pedal assembly in it. if i weren't a poorish kid who didn't need to buy new fenders, bumper/brackets and etc i would of spent the time and and money to take out that clutch pedal assy.

so i've seen a 250 prolly a 3spd manual in a 73 coupe with my own 2 eyes. believed it was a manual brake pedal assy.

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#7
BUY THE CAR DON!!!!!!

Are the 5 speed trans that better than for example, toploader 4 speed?? A friend of mine who restores cars for a living (really professional and an amazing restorer by the way) always tells me that 4 speed fits better in performance than 5 speed trans...

Anyway... BUY THE CAR DON!!!!!! Smile



Damián Cool

[Image: 120x45bk1ani.gif]
Vote For 7173Mustangs.Com Every Day!
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#8
Don65Stang;12141 Wrote:Thanks for the info. Were most of the non-Boss 351 Mach1s automatics?

I heard that only about 1% of 1971s were made with 4-speeds.
Almost everyone wanted auto then. Now even more so, it's getting hard to find a stick. The sports car guys mostly want paddle-shifters.


URUGUAYAN_FASTBACK;12154 Wrote:BUY THE CAR DON!!!!!!

Are the 5 speed trans that better than for example, toploader 4 speed?? A friend of mine who restores cars for a living (really professional and an amazing restorer by the way) always tells me that 4 speed fits better in performance than 5 speed trans...

Anyway... BUY THE CAR DON!!!!!! Smile

It depends on the 5-speed. The Tremec TKO was designed similar to the Toploader 4-speed so it has that same feel (especially with a Hurst shifter) and also is very strong. The new TKOs can handle 500 or 600ft/lbs of torque depending on model.
The toploader is much better than the popular T-5, which can only handle about 330ft/lbs of torque at best (if you have a model T-5Z). The t-5 is probably the 5-speed your friend was refering to.

1971 Mach1
351C-4v
C6 is history-->>now TKO-500
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#9
Ohh.. thanks for the explanation... mechanical parts and specs are not my spot!... i just have a toploader 4 speed on my 70 coupé (had another 70 coupe with the same trans) and i love how the gears feels sooo long... it never stop pushing!
Here in Uruguay, you just can´t find any gearbox for a mustang this days... and maybe import a 5 speed, a good one is too expensive, that´s why this guy always tells me the 4 speed is the best you can have...
I think the rear is as important as the gearbox in this ecuation, isnt it?



Damián Cool

[Image: 120x45bk1ani.gif]
Vote For 7173Mustangs.Com Every Day!
  Reply
#10
URUGUAYAN_FASTBACK;12190 Wrote:Ohh.. thanks for the explanation... mechanical parts and specs are not my spot!... i just have a toploader 4 speed on my 70 coupé (had another 70 coupe with the same trans) and i love how the gears feels sooo long... it never stop pushing!
Here in Uruguay, you just can´t find any gearbox for a mustang this days... and maybe import a 5 speed, a good one is too expensive, that´s why this guy always tells me the 4 speed is the best you can have...
I think the rear is as important as the gearbox in this ecuation, isnt it?

Yes the rear gear just adds to the transmission gear. It's most important
in first gear as well as the transmission's top gear.
If your rear ratio is numberically high like 4.11 and your transmission 1st gear is also high like 3.27, first gear will wind out too quick to be usefull. It would feel like a "granny gear" in a truck.
Likewise if top gear has a overdrive of .60 and your rear gear is 2.70, top gear would only be usefull above about 80mph.
I went with the TKO-500 because I didn't want the expense to change my rear gear of 3.00. The TKO-500 has a 1st gear ratio of 3.27 and a 5th of .68. It turned out to be a good combo. 5th is fine above about 55-60 mph, It's turning about 2K at 70mph. 1st gear got alot more torque. I calculate that 1st gear is equivenent to having a 3.81 rear gear behind a C6.
Tire size will effect your ratio too. A taller tire will effectively (numberically) lower your rear gear ratio.
I think that's why they call highway gears "taller".

1971 Mach1
351C-4v
C6 is history-->>now TKO-500
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