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Summer deadline - 72 Mach 1 Build thread
#21
The only way to correctly open up the cowl is to remove the front wind screen and drill the 1 million spot welds that hold the cowl cap on. This will give you full access to the cowl. Before going this route I would suggest climbing under the dash with a bright light and remove the two air box vent assemblies that bolt to the bottom of the cowl. These are the typical problem areas and will tell you the extent of the issue. If you have AC going under the dash is not an easy task.

BKDunha
72 Mach 1 H-Code (Concourse driven restoration)
67 S-Code Factory GT with 4-Spd

68 Mercury Cyclone (Pro-Street project)
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#22
(03-07-2019, 05:33 AM)Pegleg Wrote: Ford obviously knew these cars leaked like seives otherwise why put so many drain holes throughout the car if it wasnt to deal with water infiltration

that reminds me of a question that's been bugging me. what do the drain holes on the floor pan do ? they are plugged up with a cover, or screwed in with a metal plate as in the rear of the front seat, is the idea to release the covers when you discover a leak, do they magically open when there is water ingress ? puzzled.....
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#23
The drain holes are part of the manufacturing process. When the body is bucked and completely assembled in bare steel the bodies were dipped in a primer tank to cover the bare metal. As the body rose from the tank this allowed for drainage of the primer from the body back into the tank

BKDunha
72 Mach 1 H-Code (Concourse driven restoration)
67 S-Code Factory GT with 4-Spd

68 Mercury Cyclone (Pro-Street project)
[+] 1 user Likes bkdunha's post
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#24
I am reading your thread and it is a very similar situation that happened to me. When I bought my car the PO didn't know (or didn't disclose) any rust issues. I believe him. He was an old man and the rust was covered by a very bad restoration body work done 10 years previously. The floors were repaired with fiber glass and that's why they sounded "solid". The rest is history. I have repaired the floors, trunk, cowl and battery apron. I didn't know how to weld before I started all this and tackled the floor by myself. I did one side at a time to help keep the car in shape. Here is my long floor thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...ans-advice

In regards to the cowl you can inspect a lot through the vent openings and from the interior with a flexible camera (endoscope. I got a cheap one that I connect to my phone (similar to this, https://www.amazon.com/BlueFire-Android-...B013HZCYXK). Well worth it! Here is my method of cowl repair. By no means it is a rotisserie repair, but I avoided removing the "one million" spot welds. If no one really looks inside the cowl, they will never know how it was done. Here is a link to that thread: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-my-m...owl-repair

As you are learning things are going to take 2 to 4 times longer than planned. When I started the floors I thought it was going to be one winter, but it ended up taking me 1 1/2 years. Then came the trunk, the cowl and the battery apron. The more you inspect the more rust you find!! I have replaced pretty much every moving part little by little over the last four years. The last batch is the rear end which I am working on as I speak. This is my build thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...1-m-mach-1

Feel free to ask me any questions. I think you are in the same boat I was in four years ago..... and a few(+++) thousand dollars ago.

        [Image: 20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg]

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump
Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes
  Reply
#25
(03-07-2019, 04:11 PM)tony-muscle Wrote: I am reading your thread and it is a very similar situation that happened to me. When I bought my car the PO didn't know (or didn't disclose) any rust issues. I believe him. He was an old man and the rust was covered by a very bad restoration body work done 10 years previously. The floors were repaired with fiber glass and that's why they sounded "solid". The rest is history. I have repaired the floors, trunk, cowl and battery apron. I didn't know how to weld before I started all this and tackled the floor by myself. I did one side at a time to help keep the car in shape. Here is my long floor thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...ans-advice

In regards to the cowl you can inspect a lot through the vent openings and from the interior with a flexible camera (endoscope. I got a cheap one that I connect to my phone (similar to this, https://www.amazon.com/BlueFire-Android-...B013HZCYXK). Well worth it! Here is my method of cowl repair. By no means it is a rotisserie repair, but I avoided removing the "one million" spot welds. If no one really looks inside the cowl, they will never know how it was done. Here is a link to that thread: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-my-m...owl-repair

As you are learning things are going to take 2 to 4 times longer than planned. When I started the floors I thought it was going to be one winter, but it ended up taking me 1 1/2 years. Then came the trunk, the cowl and the battery apron. The more you inspect the more rust you find!! I have replaced pretty much every moving part little by little over the last four years. The last batch is the rear end which I am working on as I speak. This is my build thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...1-m-mach-1

Feel free to ask me any questions. I think you are in the same boat I was in four years ago..... and a few(+++) thousand dollars ago.
Tony, thanks for all the tips, will definitely reach out with questions, good to know someone has been on the road and paved a way forward like you, i don't believe seller lied and think the 2 years in which the car was in probate and parked up is where the bulk of the rust occurred.  Plus the fact I've had the car for 9 years and never once lifted the carpet puts the onus on me to have addressed the issues earlier. Some parts of the car are in amazing shape so it is a little inconsistent. I dont think i will need any external panels to be cut and welded although i haven't taken out the windshields/screens to inspect, mind you nothing will surprise me now.

Re cowls, i did exactly that, inspected through the openings and it did look like surface rust which is why i was concerned by the floor pan rust, i like the endoscope idea and will look to buy it.

I will check out your build thread.....
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#26
(03-07-2019, 01:18 PM)bkdunha Wrote: The drain holes are part of the manufacturing process. When the body is bucked and completely assembled in bare steel the bodies were dipped in a primer tank to cover the bare metal.  As the body rose from the tank this allowed for drainage of the primer from the body back into the tank

Interesting, thanks, I've learnt something new today !
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#27
(03-07-2019, 05:31 PM)baz70 Wrote:
(03-07-2019, 04:11 PM)tony-muscle Wrote: I am reading your thread and it is a very similar situation that happened to me. When I bought my car the PO didn't know (or didn't disclose) any rust issues. I believe him. He was an old man and the rust was covered by a very bad restoration body work done 10 years previously. The floors were repaired with fiber glass and that's why they sounded "solid". The rest is history. I have repaired the floors, trunk, cowl and battery apron. I didn't know how to weld before I started all this and tackled the floor by myself. I did one side at a time to help keep the car in shape. Here is my long floor thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...ans-advice

In regards to the cowl you can inspect a lot through the vent openings and from the interior with a flexible camera (endoscope. I got a cheap one that I connect to my phone (similar to this, https://www.amazon.com/BlueFire-Android-...B013HZCYXK). Well worth it! Here is my method of cowl repair. By no means it is a rotisserie repair, but I avoided removing the "one million" spot welds. If no one really looks inside the cowl, they will never know how it was done. Here is a link to that thread: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-my-m...owl-repair

As you are learning things are going to take 2 to 4 times longer than planned. When I started the floors I thought it was going to be one winter, but it ended up taking me 1 1/2 years. Then came the trunk, the cowl and the battery apron. The more you inspect the more rust you find!! I have replaced pretty much every moving part little by little over the last four years. The last batch is the rear end which I am working on as I speak. This is my build thread for reference: https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-musc...1-m-mach-1

Feel free to ask me any questions. I think you are in the same boat I was in four years ago..... and a few(+++) thousand dollars ago.
Tony, thanks for all the tips, will definitely reach out with questions, good to know someone has been on the road and paved a way forward like you, i don't believe seller lied and think the 2 years in which the car was in probate and parked up is where the bulk of the rust occurred.  Plus the fact I've had the car for 9 years and never once lifted the carpet puts the onus on me to have addressed the issues earlier. Some parts of the car are in amazing shape so it is a little inconsistent. I dont think i will need any external panels to be cut and welded although i haven't taken out the windshields/screens to inspect, mind you nothing will surprise me now.

Re cowls, i did exactly that, inspected through the openings and it did look like surface rust which is why i was concerned by the floor pan rust, i like the endoscope idea and will look to buy it.

I will check out your build thread.....


The same with my car. Some parts are in great shape while others were terrible. Hopefully I have taken care of most of the terrible spots.

        [Image: 20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg]

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump
Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes
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#28
not much progress during the week, battery apron removed and repro panel trial fitted. i don't like the repro, so much for CJPP "Classic" part. If anyone knows that i can get a less wrinkle free panel let me know from where and i will re-order. I also have the original panel and it was not wrinkled, had some dings from transit which i need to hammer out. also original panel was stamped, anyone know what the stampings signify and have these been reproduced by anyone ? thanks!

so far about a third done on battery apron, need to wirebrush rust, plug holes, trial fit and fettle, remove EP coat, prime, spot weld (need to find a spot welder from someone to reproduce factory style spot welds..... ironically that is going to be my most difficult task. I'm not buying one !

i cut off the fender support panel that goes over the battery apron and under front panel, will reweld later.

[Image: fullsizeoutput-1279.jpg]



[Image: MWPU91-Gt-Tv2-Dxv-Nbp-Yj7dw.jpg]
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#29
hmmmm, found a nasty rust hole on the shock tower, not sure what is backing it up..... unless someone says otherwise i will "cut and butt" it.


[Image: z-R4-KWzg-KSIi-Yx6w-RU86-WQ.jpg]

[Image: y-Bt-Kno-SPREe-E8-ESjx-Rt-Cx-Q.jpg]


initial view of passenger side cowl below : in a previous post i asked whether it was feasible to cut the section above to get access to the cowl and then repair as necessary. difficult to tell if its rusted through. dumb question but what's the purpose of the cowl. its not something i hear mentioned in relation to European cars bit always part of the Mustang discourse....


[Image: 0-r-BJt-Sdey-Oo-O0-Nv-Lguw.jpg]

[Image: ZVWCORHl-QLa-V63-Kytt-PTf-Q.jpg]

flip a coin generator
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#30
baz70 Wrote: initial view of passenger side cowl below :  in a previous post i asked whether it was feasible to cut the section above to get access to the cowl and then repair as necessary. difficult to tell if its rusted through. dumb question but what's the purpose of the cowl. its not something i hear mentioned in relation to European cars bit always part of the Mustang discourse....


[Image: 0-r-BJt-Sdey-Oo-O0-Nv-Lguw.jpg]

[Image: ZVWCORHl-QLa-V63-Kytt-PTf-Q.jpg]
Your picture shows the cowl's hat. The cowl takes the fresh outside air through the vents and then through the hat into the cabin. The hat is there to allow water to drain around it and not into the cabin.
It appears that you may have only surface rust. Mine had a lot of rust where the hat attaches to the cowl. I suggest you try to get pictures of inside the hat, behind the hat and from inside the cabin. The inside hat pictures you can take by extending your arm through the cowl and the pointing your phone inside the hat. Sometimes taking a video is easier. From the cabin, remove the glove box, unscrew the heater box from the hat and remove the foam in the area. This should give you enough of an opening to see the hat from the cabin. You may have to use the flexible camera I suggested in an earlier post. The area behind the hat you should be able to access through the drain hole on the fender side.

        [Image: 20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg]

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump
Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes
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