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pull engine and trans as a unit?
#1
Trying to decide if I should leave the engine and 4 speed together when i pull it out or remove trans first.  Seems like it would be easier to pull the trans while the motor is cradled in the motor mounts instead of trying to separate it while the motor is attached to the hoist.  Thoughts on best way?

Thanks!
Wade
1972 Mach 1 351 cj 4speed
"We confide in our strength, without boasting of it; we respect that of others, without fearing it."--Thomas Jefferson

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#2
(11-24-2018, 12:12 PM)scgamecock Wrote: Trying to decide if I should leave the engine and 4 speed together when i pull it out or remove trans first.  Seems like it would be easier to pull the trans while the motor is cradled in the motor mounts instead of trying to separate it while the motor is attached to the hoist.  Thoughts on best way?

 I pulled mine twice now together and put it back in together. If you don't have a big enough hoist, like a 2 ton min. you might find a smaller one a bit of a hassle. The last time I did mine, I only had a 1 ton hoist available and I needed to remove the front bumper and grill so it could get in close enough. The beam was too short in other words. Actually to avoid damage to the bumper, I would remove it first anyway. Just make life easier.
An engine leveler is a great tool to have on hand as well, especially to put it back in. I didn't have one and it was a bit harder to get the trans in. I used a low profile 1.5 ton jack under the tailstock to lift as the motor was lowered. Taking it out is far easier. You just need everything out of the way and I do mean everything right to the rad support. DON'T forget to plug your tailstock or your oil will pour out!!!
Hope that helps,
Geoff.


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I learn something new every day!
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#3
(11-24-2018, 12:32 PM)Stanglover Wrote:
(11-24-2018, 12:12 PM)scgamecock Wrote: Trying to decide if I should leave the engine and 4 speed together when i pull it out or remove trans first.  Seems like it would be easier to pull the trans while the motor is cradled in the motor mounts instead of trying to separate it while the motor is attached to the hoist.  Thoughts on best way?

 I pulled mine twice now together and put it back in together. If you don't have a big enough hoist, like a 2 ton min. you might find a smaller one a bit of a hassle. The last time I did mine, I only had a 1 ton hoist available and I needed to remove the front bumper and grill so it could get in close enough. The beam was too short in other words. Actually to avoid damage to the bumper, I would remove it first anyway. Just make life easier.
An engine leveler is a great tool to have on hand as well, especially to put it back in. I didn't have one and it was a bit harder to get the trans in. I used a low profile 1.5 ton jack under the tailstock to lift as the motor was lowered. Taking it out is far easier. You just need everything out of the way and I do mean everything right to the rad support. DON'T forget to plug your tailstock or your oil will pour out!!!
Hope that helps,
Geoff.
  Thanks Geoff this does help.  I like how you used the 2x to rest the motor on.  That will make it easier to pull the trans apart from the motor.  I was trying to figure out the best way to support it after pulling the whole unit.

Thanks!
Wade
1972 Mach 1 351 cj 4speed
"We confide in our strength, without boasting of it; we respect that of others, without fearing it."--Thomas Jefferson

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#4
I am one of the ones taking it out and putting it it in two steps. Engine first and trans second. I feel more comfortable doing it in two steps. I think it is a matter of personal taste and comfort level.
In my case i didnt have to remove the rad support. I removed the radiator because.it was part of the plan to replace it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

        [Image: 20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg]

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump
4-wheel disc brakes
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#5
Both at the same time, out and in. I find it easier to install the transmission to the engine with them out.



“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”
--Albert Einstein
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#6
I am also a fan of pulling them separate. I always have the grease plug fall out and grease is everywhere from tail shaft.
I like to cut heads off two long bolts to put in the bottom two bolt holes on the transmission. That allows you do slide it back away from pilot bushing and clutch and fork and it not drop down. Of course shifter off and engine tipped to clear the floor. Same going back in you get it on the bolts with it in first gear and you slide it on the bolts into the throw out bearing, clutch disc and pilot bushing. Rotate the tail shaft to get the clutch aligned. You will need an alignment plug for the disc to flywheel. You can get a regular bearing to go in the end of the crank and take the bronze out.
Also indicate the bell housing while you have it on the bench and adjust bell housing square if needed.
The factory slid them in as a unit but had special tilts to get it just right going in.
You should also pull the drain plug out of the block to get a little more coolant out always a mess also.
A leveler like stated is a big PIA saver.
While you have it out change all the core plugs they tend to rust out.
Now the snowball gets bigger, lol.


When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??
Tongue
David
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#7
(11-24-2018, 12:49 PM)scgamecock Wrote:
(11-24-2018, 12:32 PM)Stanglover Wrote:
(11-24-2018, 12:12 PM)scgamecock Wrote: Trying to decide if I should leave the engine and 4 speed together when i pull it out or remove trans first.  Seems like it would be easier to pull the trans while the motor is cradled in the motor mounts instead of trying to separate it while the motor is attached to the hoist.  Thoughts on best way?

 I pulled mine twice now together and put it back in together. If you don't have a big enough hoist, like a 2 ton min. you might find a smaller one a bit of a hassle. The last time I did mine, I only had a 1 ton hoist available and I needed to remove the front bumper and grill so it could get in close enough. The beam was too short in other words. Actually to avoid damage to the bumper, I would remove it first anyway. Just make life easier.
An engine leveler is a great tool to have on hand as well, especially to put it back in. I didn't have one and it was a bit harder to get the trans in. I used a low profile 1.5 ton jack under the tailstock to lift as the motor was lowered. Taking it out is far easier. You just need everything out of the way and I do mean everything right to the rad support. DON'T forget to plug your tailstock or your oil will pour out!!!
Hope that helps,
Geoff.
  Thanks Geoff this does help.  I like how you used the 2x to rest the motor on.  That will make it easier to pull the trans apart from the motor.  I was trying to figure out the best way to support it after pulling the whole unit.
 The 2X 10, I just happened to have it so I used it to set in on the frame of the hoist. Take the box of the bell housing first, 4 bolts, weighs about 100 lbs, then the bell housing. Tie a strap around the shift linkages as well. On the tailstock I use a plug, bought a set from NPD, but I only need the one. Wish they could be bought separately. To stop it falling out, wrap it good with electrical tape around the tailstock.
To be clear, you're not removing the rad support, just the rad itself, The less that's likely to get damaged the better.
I have installed the box in the car but only when I changed the clutch. It can be a pain to line up. Another thing you need is a clutch alignment tool to make sure the clutch disc is dead center or the input shaft won't go in. Tip, if it is out just a hair, a sharp bang on the clutch fork will usually release the disc enough for the shaft to go in. Worked for me anyhow.
 Geoff.

I learn something new every day!
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#8
(11-24-2018, 12:53 PM)tony-muscle Wrote: I am one of the ones taking it out and putting it it in two steps. Engine first and trans second. I feel more comfortable doing it in two steps. I think it is a matter of personal taste and comfort level.
In my case i didnt have to remove the rad support. I removed the radiator because.it was part of the plan to replace it.

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Tony, a small misunderstanding, I didn't say remove the rad support...……. or did I!! No just re-read the first reply. I said up to the rad support, so just the rad and anything else in the way was my meaning.

I learn something new every day!
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#9
(11-24-2018, 01:08 PM)Carolina_Mountain_Mustangs Wrote: I am also a fan of pulling them separate. I always have the grease plug fall out and grease is everywhere from tail shaft.
I like to cut heads off two long bolts to put in the bottom two bolt holes on the transmission. That allows you do slide it back away from pilot bushing and clutch and fork and it not drop down. Of course shifter off and engine tipped to clear the floor. Same going back in you get it on the bolts with it in first gear and you slide it on the bolts into the throw out bearing, clutch disc and pilot bushing. Rotate the tail shaft to get the clutch aligned. You will need an alignment plug for the disc to flywheel. You can get a regular bearing to go in the end of the crank and take the bronze out.
Also indicate the bell housing while you have it on the bench and adjust bell housing square if needed.
The factory slid them in as a unit but had special tilts to get it just right going in.
You should also pull the drain plug out of the block to get a little more coolant out always a mess also.
A leveler like stated is a big PIA saver.
While you have it out change all the core plugs they tend to rust out.
Now the snowball gets bigger, lol.

 Snow ball gets bigger, how true!!
Good post David.

I learn something new every day!
  Reply
#10
(11-24-2018, 12:12 PM)scgamecock Wrote: Trying to decide if I should leave the engine and 4 speed together when i pull it out or remove trans first.  Seems like it would be easier to pull the trans while the motor is cradled in the motor mounts instead of trying to separate it while the motor is attached to the hoist.  Thoughts on best way?

tranny out. doesn't balance well with in and takes more room to tip and move motor. It can be done , but not my preference.
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