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need help with suspension
#1
Hey everyone, I recently got my 71 Mach one I think I m going to make it into a pro touring car. I'm going to end up doing the coyote motor in it since I love the idea of classic with modern motors. Now I been researching a lot about suspension for the front I'm pretty set on doing the coilovers set up from tcp I believe is the company , any body running them? Also for the rear I would like to do coilovers but I can't seem to find a kit for my year car. Can anyone help or know if they make a good rear suspension kit besides coild.I rear wanna give it a nice stance,I will be building it in steps. But right now I have around 7-10k to spend. Going to be ordering American racing vn500 wheels and wilwood brakes as well. thanks for any help you guys can help me with
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#2
I am doing a very similar approach right now. I have my coyote engine and suspension, currently finishing body restore before i fit them. The first thing I've found id that installing a new engine in an old car creates a mechanical puzzle to be solved. You will find the steering needs to change the brake master cylinder needs to move among many other issues created by installing the coyote engine. I bought a front suspension kit designed for the coyote engine because it solve many of these issues. I personally find the challenge fun and I look forward to completing the project. My advice, do lots of research, call the makers of these aftermarket companies -they are very knowledgeable, and plan for things to cost much more than expected. I expect to make lots of progress on my coyote install this winter so check back, I'll post as much as I can. Good luck

EINAR
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#3
Awesome man thank you! I can't wait to see your progress. Which front suspension you doing? And rear as well?
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#4
Ya, the coyote motor will take up a lot of engine bay space. I think youll need to do some m2 setup that eliminates the shock towers.
Theres actually a guy on here that posted up a video of streetortrack.com CO system and hes running that and seems to be quite satisfied, so might want to get that one, also Maier racing has a really nice set up, he is a big competitor at the Good Guys autocross events. TCP not so many people ive seen that runs them and races them, but they seem like a really good kit nonetheless. As far as the rear, I really really love Cantilever systems, pull/push rod, panhard rods, and torque arm setup, once again Maier racing runs this and it handles!, also Vaughn Gittin JR, runs a cantilever pull/push rod rear with watts link on his RTRX 69 mustang. But in the end its what you like, I would stay away from 4 links. Heard so many bad things about that. But others are die hard about 4 links. Also if you decide to stay with leafs you can get custom made ones from eatondetriotspring.com. A good leaf spring setup is just as good as a CO system. The only thing is that it rides stiff. Theres so many different types of rears, you have to research and see what works best for you. Youtube is always a good things to use to see what rear performs better. But to handle good, you just need to get the right geometry, and roll center. ya i think thats it.


if you arent racing and just want the looks, just go with whats cheaper.

1972 Satin Black Coupe, turns better than average, goes vroom with 303 RWHP.
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#5
Thanks a lot buddy I'm going to look up the companies do yo have any links? To the cantilever parts? I m not worried about stiffness I just want to handle tight I don't race it tho. I have a fully built 2010 genesis coupe slammed to the ground you feel everything in that lol
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#6
1badmach1;159627 Wrote:Thanks a lot buddy I'm going to look up the companies do yo have any links? To the cantilever parts? I m not worried about stiffness I just want to handle tight I don't race it tho. I have a fully built 2010 genesis coupe slammed to the ground you feel everything in that lol

for tightness, theres actually a thread about a smaller ratio gearbox that will make it pretty tight. I think its made by Lees Gearbox. Also TCP has a rack and pinion set you might want. Its a little pricey but totally worth it. While youre at it, might as well want to change everything under there. I am not sure how low you want it but once you start lowering it, you start changing geometry. And youll get the problem i have. here is that thread:
http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-crazy...on-freeway
Here is my intro so you can see how low my car is ( I am going lower!)
http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-might...a-whiile-p
also someone just explained generally the different rear setups:
http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-can-s...ear-setups
But just a tip from me, dont go the cheap way. It really isnt worth it. Get the good s*** so you dont have to replace it later.

alot of these sites the coding is a little weird so youll have to go through them

http://www.maierracing.com/
http://www.maiermotorsports.com/
http://www.heidts.com/
http://www.scottshotrods.com/
http://www.streetortrack.com/Street-or-T...24491.html
http://streetortrack.com/3-Link-c-1546.html
http://streetortrack.com/Watts-Link-c-1542.html
http://www.streetortrack.com/Street-or-T...24572.html
http://www.streetortrack.com/Street-or-T...24578.html
http://www.totalcontrolproducts.com/products.html


YOUTUBE links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3OyoHs2E8o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42GTMDhLG2Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0fD5_a7lzE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MNZPLUj1JQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yswhcGT_XJg

1972 Satin Black Coupe, turns better than average, goes vroom with 303 RWHP.
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#7
I too am building in the touring style (my car is not "PRO" anything). I also am very budget minded and HATE to spend money on stuff I can build or modify myself. There are many upgrades that can be done to the stock suspension on our cars to get a very good result. Remember Ford did MANY suspension upgrades to our cars over the early cars. The biggest are in suspension geometry and steering. My approach is to take what is there and optimize it to build what I can best describe is a "Grand Touring" car. A car that can go anywhere anytime, with a level of comfort, style and performance. A car that is comfortable on an autocross, can stop, steer and accelerate well, deliver decent drivability and economy. I also plan to drive my car extensively. I plan to use as many "off the shelf" OEM parts as possible. If it breaks somewhere on the road I'd like to go to a local parts store and get what is needed, not wait 2-3 days for a "specialty" part to get delivered.

It really depends on what you want to do with the car. I would recommend getting a copy of Herb Adams' book Chassis Engineering and familiarizing yourself with the concepts behind what makes a "good handling" car. Throwing cash at this kit or another without knowing if they will suit your needs is not what I would recommend. Mustang II setups are fine for streetrods but are wholly inadequate for performance applications. Do you want a show car, a solid performing driver or a corner cutting monster? These all need to be approached differently. The key is being happy with what you built.

Do some research on suspension design, look at what's available and make an informed decision. Corner Carvers.com has some very extensive discussion on early Mustang suspension. It is highly technical and the site is not tolerant of asking questions without researching the site first. It is a great source of performance handling information, these guys are hardcore handling junkies. Look to the old Trans Am series and the modern Australian Supercar series, those technologies worked and still do. Check out the Boss 302 Chassis Guide, there are many modifications there that are adaptable to a solid street car.

Make wise decisions there are too many "snake oil" salesmen in the car hobby, all too willing to take your money for products that don't deliver. Look to good companies that support their product.

Jeff T.

Low buck, touring style, '73 Convertible "rolling restoration", 351c, 2v heads with a shave and a haircut, Performer intake, Holley 650(ish), roller rockers, screw in studs, guideplates, stainless valves, Duraspark / Motorsports MSD, T-5 conversion. 1-1/8" front, 3/4" rear swaybars KYB shocks and some home brewed subframe connectors. Future plans; JGC steering box, Cobra brakes and... paint, interior, etc.

When I die I want to die like grandpa, peacefully in my sleep... not screaming, like his passenger.

[Image: 1_12_09_14_10_15_11.png]
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#8
I am installing a front end kit from Rod and Custom Motoersports. http://rcmotorsportsinc.com/ I mainly chose them because after talking to them, they had previously installed a coyote in a 71 mustang. They kit came with complete instructions and images of modifications needed to fit the engine in the bay. Its a MII style suspension kit that removes towers and adds a new crossmember and retrofits a rack and pinion, 2" drop spindles also avaiable.

I'm current staying with a leaf setup in the rear for the cost and that I'm not looking for high performance. I'm looking for a solid handler that rides well on the highway since I plan to put many miles on the road and a few trips to the road course for learning and fun.

I'm very glad you started this thread and for all the great reply's from everyone. THis will help out my install as well.

EINAR
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#9
+1 on the M2 suspension. I too was going to go with this kit, after doing some research I discovered that it was a crap front kit. It was just literally the front for a pinto with little bit of different items. Like droptop said there is a lot of different kits that arent to expensive. Unless you have cash to spare then go ahead. The cantilever system is such a sweet suspension. I just love it the design the geometry everything. BUt i dont have 7k to throw at it. For now I am just getting some SFC, 200LB racing springs with my ride height, RSB, Panhard rod, and some good shocks. THis will make it handle really nicely (I race it). and will cost me about about 1k. The front same concept, keep it simple with good parts. For now its just some good shocks, 600LB coils, FSB, different alignment spec, different gearbox. that will do a lot of improvement, while costing me about 600. THis will give you that perfect "pro-touring" stance, and handling around the canyons or tracks.


and btw i would stay away from calling your car a "pro-touring" car. PT cars are just show cars. I think Trans Am inspired car is better.

Einar'sMach1;159663 Wrote:I am installing a front end kit from Rod and Custom Motoersports. http://rcmotorsportsinc.com/ I mainly chose them because after talking to them, they had previously installed a coyote in a 71 mustang. They kit came with complete instructions and images of modifications needed to fit the engine in the bay. Its a MII style suspension kit that removes towers and adds a new crossmember and retrofits a rack and pinion, 2" drop spindles also avaiable.

I'm current staying with a leaf setup in the rear for the cost and that I'm not looking for high performance. I'm looking for a solid handler that rides well on the highway since I plan to put many miles on the road and a few trips to the road course for learning and fun.

I'm very glad you started this thread and for all the great reply's from everyone. THis will help out my install as well.


im eh on the drop spindles, they seem to cause some geometry issues, and cause more bumpsteer than you would like.

1972 Satin Black Coupe, turns better than average, goes vroom with 303 RWHP.
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#10
Personally from my experience, I would hesitate to use high rate springs for a car that will see street use.

If I remember the only dropped spindles for our cars are from Fat Man. They require use of Granada brake parts. I don't think there is any advantage to them except lowering the stance. If the steering arms are still in the same location as the stock spindles bump steer should not be a huge issue.

Jeff T.

Low buck, touring style, '73 Convertible "rolling restoration", 351c, 2v heads with a shave and a haircut, Performer intake, Holley 650(ish), roller rockers, screw in studs, guideplates, stainless valves, Duraspark / Motorsports MSD, T-5 conversion. 1-1/8" front, 3/4" rear swaybars KYB shocks and some home brewed subframe connectors. Future plans; JGC steering box, Cobra brakes and... paint, interior, etc.

When I die I want to die like grandpa, peacefully in my sleep... not screaming, like his passenger.

[Image: 1_12_09_14_10_15_11.png]
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