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HHO Injection & better mileage
#1
Maybe this is controversial, maybe not. Anyway, I was a skeptic and still am. My 17 year old son & his buddies in HS have made 2 HHO (Brown's gas) generators out of pickle jars, installed them on a Toyota Camry and a 1989 Ford F150. Both vehicles are showing a remarkable increase in fuel economy. The hydrogen and oxygen is NOT used to fuel the cars nor could enough be created to do so. What it does do is makes the air fuel mixture ignite much faster thus making a cleaner, more efficient burn and leans out the mixture needed for the same amount of performance. More efficient burn = more mpgs.

Supposedly it works better on carbureted engines so I thought I'd start a discussion on here if anyone wanted to play with it. I'm going to make one for my diesel excursion since that is my biggest fuel bill and I'm going to make one on the cheap...but not pickle jar cheap like the high schoolers. I'm going to use a 4" PVC pipe with a screw cap on one end to refill with distilled water some thin stainless steel plates separated by plastic bolts, washers and nuts then pipe the HHO gas into my intake. If I blow up, you already know what happened to me. LOL

Here are a couple of threads for background info. Whatever you do, don't buy a setup from anyone on the internet. Make your own.

http://www.gassavers.org/showthread.php?t=6927

http://www.thedieselstop.com/forums/f22/...en-199922/

If you think this is crazy, me too but I'll only be out a few bucks and can say I tried it. I'll let you know how it works out if anyone is interested.


.

[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
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#2
Interesting concept. Let us know what you come up with.
  Reply
#3
Don65Stang;21997 Wrote:Maybe this is controversial, maybe not. Anyway, I was a skeptic and still am. My 17 year old son & his buddies in HS have made 2 HHO (Brown's gas) generators out of pickle jars, installed them on a Toyota Camry and a 1989 Ford F150. Both vehicles are showing a remarkable increase in fuel economy. The hydrogen and oxygen is NOT used to fuel the cars nor could enough be created to do so. What it does do is makes the air fuel mixture ignite much faster thus making a cleaner, more efficient burn and leans out the mixture needed for the same amount of performance. More efficient burn = more mpgs.

Supposedly it works better on carbureted engines so I thought I'd start a discussion on here if anyone wanted to play with it. I'm going to make one for my diesel excursion since that is my biggest fuel bill and I'm going to make one on the cheap...but not pickle jar cheap like the high schoolers. I'm going to use a 4" PVC pipe with a screw cap on one end to refill with distilled water some thin stainless steel plates separated by plastic bolts, washers and nuts then pipe the HHO gas into my intake. If I blow up, you already know what happened to me. LOL

Here are a couple of threads for background info. Whatever you do, don't buy a setup from anyone on the internet. Make your own.

http://www.gassavers.org/showthread.php?t=6927

http://www.thedieselstop.com/forums/f22/...en-199922/

If you think this is crazy, me too but I'll only be out a few bucks and can say I tried it. I'll let you know how it works out if anyone is interested.


.

how about we work together on this. all S Steel and no pvc. you tell me what you need and I will weld it together. what do you think??
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#4
Doc and Don

I used to work with a fellow who did this to his F150 and he said he was over 30 MPG at the time ....what i'll do if you like is try to get his plans from him because he has been fine tuning this for about 10 years.

[Image: 1_14_01_12_10_54_29.png]

Ken

73 Convertible 302-4v-3spd yellow /white int

08 Bullitt 4.6-5 spd black/black int


All I ask is a chance to prove that money can't make me happy
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#5
Don65Stang;21997 Wrote:If I blow up, you already know what happened to me. LOL

LOL! Yeah I'm a skeptic too but let me know how it turns out, the concept IS intriguing (sp?).

Steve



[Image: 25yvyp3.jpg]
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#6
Warning. Theoretically you could blow yourself up. Proceed at your own risk. However, for me, blowing stuff up is cool so I press onward with safety goggles.

HHO Generator design (via high school boys with no money)
The ultra cheap setup the HS boys' made version which a 1/2 gallon pickle jar with lid. Inside the jar they used 5 galvanized light switch covers with two nylon bolts holding them all together but with nylon washers in between each plate so the plates can't/don't touch each other and short out setup. They ran two wires through a small hole in the lid and connected them to each side of the switch plates so one side is positive and the other is negative. The plate assembly is inside the jar filled with distilled water almost to the top and a small amount of baking soda added to make the reaction happen quickly. The other end of the wires hook to the battery via a switch and a fuse. The drilled a small hole in the lid to fit a piece of tubing slightly larger than vacuum line that goes through the lid but well above the water line. The other end of the line goes through a hole they made in the intake air tube. When switch on the water will bubble off oxygen and hydrogen. The jar and lid are tightly sealed so it won't leak fluid or let the HHO escape past the wires or tube that goes through the lid. For the carb setups just route the line into the air cleaner near the carb throat. Also, my setup will be better designed. I don't suggest you copy this setup. I only provided to show what the HS boys did.

Safety first.
CAUTION: Beware of a backfire...don't know what that would do but wanted to throw that out there - glass shrapnel would not be a fun thing to experience.
Precautionary suggestions.
1. Don't use a pickle jar, try a Mason jar if you insist on using glass. LOL A Mason jar is designed for canning in high heat, however, I have seen them explode in an oven.
2. Add both a fuse and a 15amp resistor to the positive line to keep things from getting too hot in the container and blowing up. The more baking soda added the faster the boil. The 1/2 gallon (+/-) amount of water lasts for more than a tank of fuel in their test vehicles.
3. Don't let the HHO generator run while the engine isn't. It will drain your battery and there would be an excessive amount of hydrogen and oxygen under your hood...One spark from the alternator and KABOOM! there goes your NACA hood 20 feet into the air. Or in my case rust shrapnel from the NACA hood.

There are better plans (free plans if you do some searching from guys like us who post their experiences) for the HHO generators on the net from others who have done this. I'm still researching for the exact metal electrode design to go into the water. A certain type of stainless steel is supposed to work best but cannot remember the type. Will post later...I think I saw it on the gassaver site.


NOTE: Other forums have banned this topic not because it works or not but because other members started name calling, fussing about exaggerated claims, fussing about not being able to run a car on hydrogen, fussing about it taking too much electricity to produce the amount to hydrogen needed to run the car, scam artist jumping in, and a bunch of childish behavior. I don't want to see that here because the initial results show that it does work.

Let me say it one more time... I'm not trying to run the car on hydrogen. I do want to add a little hydrogen to my airflow to get the initial combustion process started just before the gasoline ignites so as to get a better bang from the gasoline. The gas still completely powers the car. The hydrogen ONLY makes the process happen a little nicer, cleaner, better. Whatever...it appears to work (said with a skeptic tone in my voice).

Let the fun begin, no mean posts and I assume NO responsibility for this. Big Grin


.

whitesoc;22008 Wrote:Doc and Don

I used to work with a fellow who did this to his F150 and he said he was over 30 MPG at the time ....what i'll do if you like is try to get his plans from him because he has been fine tuning this for about 10 years.

Heck yeah...but just like we say in the intro threads:

worthless

I'll post my pics as I put mine together. Maybe I can snap a pic of the pickle jar setup the next time the boys are over at the house (not often).



[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
  Reply
#7
I have done some research on this and it does seem to have merit. I'll be watching!

Jeff T.

Low buck, touring style, '73 Convertible "rolling restoration", 351c, 2v heads with a shave and a haircut, Performer intake, Holley 650(ish), roller rockers, screw in studs, guideplates, stainless valves, Duraspark / Motorsports MSD, T-5 conversion. 1-1/8" front, 3/4" rear swaybars KYB shocks and some home brewed subframe connectors. Future plans; JGC steering box, Cobra brakes and... paint, interior, etc.

When I die I want to die like grandpa, peacefully in my sleep... not screaming, like his passenger.

[Image: 1_12_09_14_10_15_11.png]
  Reply
#8
I really like this guy's experience with his Bronco:

http://www.thedieselstop.com/forums/1581120-post49.html

Doc: That sounds great. Let's find a design and see what size container seems to work best. 1 quart, half gallon... I don't know at this point.

[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
  Reply
#9
Don, I don't know anything about this, but I would worry about a lean condition on the diesel. I suppose you could keep an eye on EGT?

That said, I enjoy this type of thinking outside the box!
  Reply
#10
I don't know much about it either! I've read a ton of posts from others saying it works and an equal amount from nay sayers. Not trying or wanting to start that debate on our wonderful forum but I would like to tinker with it and see for myself.

I also read since my initial post that it's not too much of a difference on diesels because they are already fairly efficient engines. It seems that the consensus is that carb engines are the easiest to set up. The EFI cars take a little more effort to see results. Others say there will never be any results. Would be interesting to see some definitive results from our carb cars.


[Image: 386_07_10_13_5_58_42.jpeg]
My Mustangs:
71 M-code Mach 1, Medium Blue/White Sport, 4R70W, 3L50, Factory Ram Air.
72 Q-code Mach 1, Pewter/Black Sport, 4-spd, 3L25.
65 Convertible, Britney Blue/White/White, more modified than original.
05 Convertible, Legend Lime/Tan/Tan, future classic??
  Reply
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