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Droptop73 a little feed back Plz
#1
Long term goals for our 73 Vert include Coyote 5.0 drivetrain. Which will intail new front suspension & steering. No telling how long sourcing a donor 2012-13 Mustang will take.
So in the interim to fix a loose center steering issue, I'm thinking bout replacing the steering box. Ball joints tie rods, and ideler seem to be in good condition as is strut rod rubber. My Brother was the PO, and I can see him having replaced most of the steering replacables.
As long as I'm gonna replace the steerng box anyway, I've sourced an OTS Cardone 93-96 Grand Cherokee pn # 27-7582, fer $125 shipped & done(no core chg). Seller won't budge off the price.
Soooo Mr. Droptop73, in your experience. Is this an approriate $$, and izzt likely to be whats needed to cure the loose center steering issue?? I always seem to get into WYAI's...any other feed back iz apperciated.

TIA
Tubo
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#2
IRT the Coyote set-up, you might consider just getting a Ford Motorsports 'crate' Coyote engine and ECU. According to an article I read in Mustang Monthly sometime last year, the ECU controlling the engine has some kind of 'defeat' built-in to prevent someone from transplanting the engine - with OR without the ECU (I'm guessing BCU or something else entirely controls this).

http://www.mustangmonthly.com/featuredve...ewall.html

Gateway Classic might also have their kit together by now as well.

I'm thinking that unless you can get the donor car for basically nothing, you might be better served just going with new stuff, all things considered.


BTW - that's one of my favorite issues to re-read in the, umm... 'Library,' because I really dig the '69 - especially, its wheels.

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#3
Mister 4x4;130521 Wrote:IRT the Coyote set-up, you might consider just getting a Ford Motorsports 'crate' Coyote engine and ECU. According to an article I read in Mustang Monthly sometime last year, the ECU controlling the engine has some kind of 'defeat' built-in to prevent someone from transplanting the engine - with OR without the ECU (I'm guessing BCU or something else entirely controls this).

http://www.mustangmonthly.com/featuredve...ewall.html

Gateway Classic might also have their kit together by now as well.

I'm thinking that unless you can get the donor car for basically nothing, you might be better served just going with new stuff, all things considered.


BTW - that's one of my favorite issues to re-read in the, umm... 'Library,' because I really dig the '69 - especially, its wheels.
The Coyote crate is real world $5800 then add $1200 for harness and ECU, and here is the glaring deal breaker for me. FRPP harness & ECU do not support 6R80 6spd automatic trans.
and I want the select shift which wasn't available till 2013 model. So I'm aware I may have to wait for a bit. wrecked Mustang GT might be had for $8k or less. I have some friends who buy at auction
Having a complete donor car will allow use of the entire drive train, plus plenty of extra goodies I can also swap into the 73 Vert. I saw a 70 with a 10 dash in it..Radio, A/C, insturments.
Much like my 2+2 there won't be many origional pars remaining on the 73. All the 2+2 has is; the unibody, two front fenders, the axle carrier, and a very few interior pannels.
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#4
Sounds like you got a plan. Good luck with it! Sounds like a crazy-cool conversion. Be interesting to see it done in one of our model years. Wink

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#5
Tubo;130509 Wrote:So in the interim to fix a loose center steering issue, I'm thinking bout replacing the steering box. Ball joints tie rods, and ideler seem to be in good condition as is strut rod rubber. My Brother was the PO, and I can see him having replaced most of the steering replacables.
As long as I'm gonna replace the steerng box anyway, I've sourced an OTS Cardone 93-96 Grand Cherokee pn # 27-7582, fer $125 shipped & done(no core chg). Seller won't budge off the price.
Soooo Mr. Droptop73, in your experience. Is this an approriate $$, and izzt likely to be whats needed to cure the loose center steering issue?? I always seem to get into WYAI's...any other feed back iz apperciated.

TIA
Tubo

That seems like a good price for a rebuilt box. I have heard good things about Cardone remans. As far as installation, from the research I have done the box should bolt into our cars. The steering coupler may need to be "adapted" from other components, it depends on the splines. The original Mustang pitman arm should be a direct fit to the JGC box. A set of either adapter hoses or a set of fittings from Lee will be required, the JGC box has metric o-ring fittings ant the original box has inverted flare fittings. I have sourced a used box from a local pick a part and am cleaning it up. I have not started the install yet.

Here are the best sources for information I have found on the subject. Sorry for the "brand X" reading material! LOL

http://forum.grantorinosport.org/steerin...page1.html

http://www.chevelles.com/techref/ftecref29.html

For fitting adapters,
http://www.lee-powersteering.com/

Please share any information you find/figure out. I am having fun driving mine and am waiting for a crummy weekend to really get into figuring this out for sure. The information looks promising.

Jeff T.

Low buck, touring style, '73 Convertible "rolling restoration", 351c, 2v heads with a shave and a haircut, Performer intake, Holley 650(ish), roller rockers, screw in studs, guideplates, stainless valves, Duraspark / Motorsports MSD, T-5 conversion. 1-1/8" front, 3/4" rear swaybars KYB shocks and some home brewed subframe connectors. Future plans; JGC steering box, Cobra brakes and... paint, interior, etc.

When I die I want to die like grandpa, peacefully in my sleep... not screaming, like his passenger.

[Image: 1_12_09_14_10_15_11.png]
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#6
Mister 4x4;130521 Wrote:.....the ECU controlling the engine has some kind of 'defeat' built-in to prevent someone from transplanting the engine - .........

Yeah Eric, the defeat is part of the PATS(Passive Anti-Theft System) Everyting electric is tied together, break a link and nothing works. In reading bout how to make this conversion work, a grounding cable from a specific build date, was needed to work with the donor engine's VIN code.
Thats why having a Donor can be important, so you have the whole system to begin with.
Gateway is prolly going to be my source for front suspension, I hear they have a kit (for big cars) that will use the electric power steering. won't have to reverse engineer a PS pump mount fer the Coyote.
Yup should be educational.

Tubo

droptop73;130622 Wrote:......That seems like a good price for a rebuilt box. I have heard good things about Cardone remans. As far as installation, from the research I have done the box should bolt into our cars. The steering coupler may need to be "adapted" from other components, it depends on the splines. The original Mustang pitman arm should be a direct fit to the JGC box. A set of either adapter hoses or a set of fittings from Lee will be required, the JGC box has metric o-ring fittings ant the original box has inverted flare fittings......Please share any information you find/figure out. I am having fun driving mine and am waiting for a crummy weekend to really get into figuring this out for sure. The information looks promising.

Good!! That's jibing with the bit of info I've found so far, however your links I haven't seen as yet, TY's. And I was curious bout Cardone quality. So I'll go ahead and pull the trigger on the "deal".
O'course I'll be happy to share anything I learn, Butt it may take several Crummy weekends to get to it, Hehheh.

Tubo
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#7
Tubo;130667 Wrote:
Mister 4x4;130521 Wrote:.....the ECU controlling the engine has some kind of 'defeat' built-in to prevent someone from transplanting the engine - .........

Yeah Eric, the defeat is part of the PATS(Passive Anti-Theft System) Everyting electric is tied together, break a link and nothing works. In reading bout how to make this conversion work, a grounding cable from a specific build date, was needed to work with the donor engine's VIN code.
Thats why having a Donor can be important, so you have the whole system to begin with.
Gateway is prolly going to be my source for front suspension, I hear they have a kit (for big cars) that will use the electric power steering. won't have to reverse engineer a PS pump mount fer the Coyote.
Yup should be educational.

Tubo
Yeah... "PATS." I remember reading something about that as well. Sounds like you're amassing quite the pile of research info.

I think one of the biggest advantages Gateway Classic had going is that Dynacorn makes 'notched' shock towers for the '69-'70. It probably wouldn't be such a big deal with a completely new "Mustang II"-style front suspension set-up to simply make the modifications to the existing shock towers, but dang - that's a lot of R&D and work to make that happen (another reason I'm bummed about the industry not showing as much love to our models as the previous years).

Keep us posted, please. I'm anxious to see this all come together. thumb

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#8
Crummy weekends... EXACTLY! Big Grin Let's share as much information as possible on making this swap work. The difference on other brands of cars seems to be pretty significant in steering response and road feel.

Rather than the MII front end do some research on the CorteX system or the Detroit Speed pieces and whether they could be adapted to our cars. I am not sure how the frame rail differences would afect the install.

Jeff T.

Low buck, touring style, '73 Convertible "rolling restoration", 351c, 2v heads with a shave and a haircut, Performer intake, Holley 650(ish), roller rockers, screw in studs, guideplates, stainless valves, Duraspark / Motorsports MSD, T-5 conversion. 1-1/8" front, 3/4" rear swaybars KYB shocks and some home brewed subframe connectors. Future plans; JGC steering box, Cobra brakes and... paint, interior, etc.

When I die I want to die like grandpa, peacefully in my sleep... not screaming, like his passenger.

[Image: 1_12_09_14_10_15_11.png]
  Reply
#9
Take a look at the rag joint before doing the steering box.

If it has never been replaced, I would bet it is pretty sloppy.

If you don't know what a rag joint is, it is a piece of tire rubber that is actually engaging your steering wheel to the steering linkage.

$10, one hour.

[Image: 11jmcuc.png]
351C Bold Manners, Brash Attitude
Favorite Teams: Michigan Wolverines and Whoever Is Playing Ohio State.

When I drive past a herd of cows, the cows MOO at me
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#10
Picked up the Grand Cherokee PS box at my Buddy MustangSteve's house, Friday. MS, myself & several others from his forum, went to The Texas Dream Cruise together.
I'm back home now and will start installation of the box soon. Doesn't look to be too terrible hard. Humph thats the ones that get difficult though, ain't they.
Photos & dialog will be fourth coming.
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