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3 point seat belt install (SEATBELT sOLUTIONS)
#11
I have purchased the same kit, I have found the hole in the roof and it seems to be the same size hole /thread (course) as the bolts that hold the seat frame on.
I m not sure in the above guide why the reactor was placed and mounted to the floor pan in a different position to the end of the Belt strap?
The the long metal shaped piece on the end of the belt strap is designed to fit behind the reactor /tensioner and share the same frame hole?

I just watched the Video on the CJ Pony youtube channel, they are fitting the kit to an earlier 60s mustang. I can see why they needed to drill the floor BUT, If your fitting this kit to a 71-73 Just use the same side mount hole and don't drill the floor.

I'm using my original factory seat belt holes so most of the parts and angle brackets supplied in the kit are not needed. Wink
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#12
If you want the correct concourse seatbelt anchor bolts, these are now available from Mustang Vendors Smile
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#13
I installed this very same kit in mine, and used the factory correct mounting bolts, instead of the ones that came with the kit - no worries, issues, or otherwise.  There is no reason to drill any new holes or otherwise.  The upper mounts go in the shoulder belt mounting holes close to what would be the 'B-pillars' (if our cars had them), the stationary belts go to the factory locations on the transmission tunnel, and the retractors/anchor points go to the factory mounting points in the rockers (right behind the door openings).

Yes, both mounting brackets can share the same hole(s).  They're solid anchor points directly in the uni-body 'frame' section of the rockers (not the floor pan sheet metal).  Kind of a clunky design, but I'm guessing it's more of a universal kind of design, despite being spec'd for our cars.

I will say that the plastic on the trim piece of the retractor where the belt feeds out is kind of brittle, as mine's cracked already after just 5 years of installation, being garage-kept, and very light use.  But otherwise, I love 'em.

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#14
I do not have retractable three-point belts in my FB, I have considered adding them but that's down the road.

At risk of coming off troll-ish, I don't think this (photo blatantly stolen)

[Image: seat-belt-guide.jpg]

Is a good idea. This mounting scheme will pass all of the load from an impact through the fasteners holding the clip or belt guide to the seat, and if those fasteners somehow don't fail, the seat back retaining mechanism.

If the force is enough to fail the belt guide fasteners or the seat back mechanism, the upper body of the occupant is not restrained, and that is bad Sad

Carry on...
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#15
I can't see your picture from here at work, but I believe the fasteners that come in the kit are Grade 8.  As well, substituting the factory-style fasteners should also be fine because I believe those to be Grade 8 as well.

After becoming intimately familiar with the sheet metal in and around the floor pans (I replaced mine, along with about 60% of the rest of the factory sheet metal due to rust issues), I can honestly say that the seat belt mounting points on our cars are just as solid as any of the other [more modern] cars I've worked on in my lifetime so far.

Having said that, I wouldn't trust the factory seats to offer much in the way of extra support during a major impact.  In fact, I wouldn't really say that our cars are anywhere close to being as safe as the modern cars.

You don't want to be in an accident in one of these cars, anymore than you'd want them to suffer any damage at all.  However, the 3-point kit, in my opinion, is inherently safer and should offer the same if not better protection during an impact than what the factory dual-belts could provide.  That, and there aren't any clips to fail and drop that shoulder belt on your head while you're rolling over bumps in the road (unlike the ones in my Mom's '70 Galaxie 500).

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#16
Eric-

In case it didn’t show up, the pic I stole and was referring to shows the belt coming down from the roof through a retaining loop attached to the side of the seat and then across the shoulder of the occupant.

I am with you that the crashworthiness of a 1971 vehicle isn’t comparable to hat of a modern car, my comment was my opinion that as shown in the picture, the installation of the retractable belt kit would be worse than the original, non-retractable, Ford-designed separate shoulder and lap belt system.

I wouldn’t want somebody to go through the trouble of adding the retractable belts only to be worse off.

Again, that’s just my opinion.

Carry on!

-Matt
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#17
(01-23-2020, 07:00 PM)mjlan Wrote: Eric-

In case it didn’t show up, the pic I stole and was referring to shows the belt coming down from the roof through a retaining loop attached to the side of the seat and then across the shoulder of the occupant.

I am with you that the crashworthiness of a 1971 vehicle isn’t comparable to hat of a modern car, my comment was my opinion that as shown in the picture, the installation of the retractable belt kit would be worse than the original, non-retractable, Ford-designed separate shoulder and lap belt system.

I wouldn’t want somebody to go through the trouble of adding the retractable belts only to be worse off.

Again, that’s just my opinion.

Carry on!

-Matt


I saw the pic when I got home last night, and noticed what you were talking about.  That's a custom addition to that particular seat - it looked like it had Deluxe seat upholstery that would've been correct for our cars, however that seat belt loop is completely out of place.  It could also be an aftermarket seat (like Distinctive Industries, TMI Pro Seats, or something else altogether).

I'm not a fan of those, either.  I'm also pretty sure they're not designed for any kind of support during impact.  I broke one off my wife's 01 Grand Prix driver seat a few years ago, and had Hell trying to find a replacement.  It was plastic.  She insisted she needs it because it keeps the shoulder portion of the seat belt in a better position for her (since she's only 5'2").  My Mom has the car now (she's taller at 5'7") and doesn't care that I still haven't replaced it.  Something I did notice is the loops on her '15 Camaro seats are nothing more than canvas loops sewn to the seats with snaps to close 'em up around the belts.  I know those will definitely not offer any support during a crash... but then again, there are airbags galore on those cars (we found out the hard way in Aug 2017 when we got T-boned on the freeway - long story).

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#18
(01-24-2020, 11:46 AM)Mister 4x4 Wrote:
(01-23-2020, 07:00 PM)mjlan Wrote: Eric-

In case it didn’t show up, the pic I stole and was referring to shows the belt coming down from the roof through a retaining loop attached to the side of the seat and then across the shoulder of the occupant.

I am with you that the crashworthiness of a 1971 vehicle isn’t comparable to hat of a modern car, my comment was my opinion that as shown in the picture, the installation of the retractable belt kit would be worse than the original, non-retractable, Ford-designed separate shoulder and lap belt system.

I wouldn’t want somebody to go through the trouble of adding the retractable belts only to be worse off.

Again, that’s just my opinion.

Carry on!

-Matt


I saw the pic when I got home last night, and noticed what you were talking about.  That's a custom addition to that particular seat - it looked like it had Deluxe seat upholstery that would've been correct for our cars, however that seat belt loop is completely out of place.  It could also be an aftermarket seat (like Distinctive Industries, TMI Pro Seats, or something else altogether).

I'm not a fan of those, either.  I'm also pretty sure they're not designed for any kind of support during impact.  I broke one off my wife's 01 Grand Prix driver seat a few years ago, and had Hell trying to find a replacement.  It was plastic.  She insisted she needs it because it keeps the shoulder portion of the seat belt in a better position for her (since she's only 5'2").  My Mom has the car now (she's taller at 5'7") and doesn't care that I still haven't replaced it.  Something I did notice is the loops on her '15 Camaro seats are nothing more than canvas loops sewn to the seats with snaps to close 'em up around the belts.  I know those will definitely not offer any support during a crash... but then again, there are airbags galore on those cars (we found out the hard way in Aug 2017 when we got T-boned on the freeway - long story).




Wait a minute ... T-boned on the freeway Chin

Freeways around me are 3-4-5 lanes of traffic all going the same way
I knew you would find a way to get the Chevy out of the garage whistling  rofl rofl rofl rofl
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#19
(01-25-2020, 10:53 AM)OMS Wrote:
(01-24-2020, 11:46 AM)Mister 4x4 Wrote:
(01-23-2020, 07:00 PM)mjlan Wrote: Eric-

In case it didn’t show up, the pic I stole and was referring to shows the belt coming down from the roof through a retaining loop attached to the side of the seat and then across the shoulder of the occupant.

I am with you that the crashworthiness of a 1971 vehicle isn’t comparable to hat of a modern car, my comment was my opinion that as shown in the picture, the installation of the retractable belt kit would be worse than the original, non-retractable, Ford-designed separate shoulder and lap belt system.

I wouldn’t want somebody to go through the trouble of adding the retractable belts only to be worse off.

Again, that’s just my opinion.

Carry on!

-Matt


I saw the pic when I got home last night, and noticed what you were talking about.  That's a custom addition to that particular seat - it looked like it had Deluxe seat upholstery that would've been correct for our cars, however that seat belt loop is completely out of place.  It could also be an aftermarket seat (like Distinctive Industries, TMI Pro Seats, or something else altogether).

I'm not a fan of those, either.  I'm also pretty sure they're not designed for any kind of support during impact.  I broke one off my wife's 01 Grand Prix driver seat a few years ago, and had Hell trying to find a replacement.  It was plastic.  She insisted she needs it because it keeps the shoulder portion of the seat belt in a better position for her (since she's only 5'2").  My Mom has the car now (she's taller at 5'7") and doesn't care that I still haven't replaced it.  Something I did notice is the loops on her '15 Camaro seats are nothing more than canvas loops sewn to the seats with snaps to close 'em up around the belts.  I know those will definitely not offer any support during a crash... but then again, there are airbags galore on those cars (we found out the hard way in Aug 2017 when we got T-boned on the freeway - long story).




Wait a minute ... T-boned on the freeway Chin

Freeways around me are 3-4-5 lanes of traffic all going the same way
I knew you would find a way to get the Chevy out of the garage whistling  rofl rofl rofl rofl

Oddly enough - yes, "T-boned on the freeway."  We were heading up the on-ramp, got to speed, merged in front of an F-150, and a late-model Dodge Dart was doing 90+ behind the truck, changed lanes, lost control, was sliding sideways through the median passing the F-150 (that's how fast he had been going), caught some traction when his front wheels got back on the asphalt, and shot right into the driver side of her car.  After everybody finally got stopped, he somehow got his car started and fled the scene (of course).

Here's the damage:


[Image: crash3.JPG]

Here are the airbags that deployed (also notice the crease in the rocker = totaled) - the black strap with chrome snap just under the airbag on the right side of the pic is the seat belt loop I mentioned earlier.  Surprisingly, it didn't come unsnapped during the crash): 

[Image: crash1.JPG]

Rest assured, though - there's still a Camaro in the fleet.



[Image: carmen1.jpg]

Eric

[Image: mach1sig2.gif]
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#20
(01-25-2020, 04:19 PM)Mister 4x4 Wrote:
(01-25-2020, 10:53 AM)OMS Wrote:
(01-24-2020, 11:46 AM)Mister 4x4 Wrote: I saw the pic when I got home last night, and noticed what you were talking about.  That's a custom addition to that particular seat - it looked like it had Deluxe seat upholstery that would've been correct for our cars, however that seat belt loop is completely out of place.  It could also be an aftermarket seat (like Distinctive Industries, TMI Pro Seats, or something else altogether).

I'm not a fan of those, either.  I'm also pretty sure they're not designed for any kind of support during impact.  I broke one off my wife's 01 Grand Prix driver seat a few years ago, and had Hell trying to find a replacement.  It was plastic.  She insisted she needs it because it keeps the shoulder portion of the seat belt in a better position for her (since she's only 5'2").  My Mom has the car now (she's taller at 5'7") and doesn't care that I still haven't replaced it.  Something I did notice is the loops on her '15 Camaro seats are nothing more than canvas loops sewn to the seats with snaps to close 'em up around the belts.  I know those will definitely not offer any support during a crash... but then again, there are airbags galore on those cars (we found out the hard way in Aug 2017 when we got T-boned on the freeway - long story).




Wait a minute ... T-boned on the freeway Chin

Freeways around me are 3-4-5 lanes of traffic all going the same way
I knew you would find a way to get the Chevy out of the garage whistling  rofl rofl rofl rofl

Oddly enough - yes, "T-boned on the freeway."  We were heading up the on-ramp, got to speed, merged in front of an F-150, and a late-model Dodge Dart was doing 90+ behind the truck, changed lanes, lost control, was sliding sideways through the median passing the F-150 (that's how fast he had been going), caught some traction when his front wheels got back on the asphalt, and shot right into the driver side of her car.  After everybody finally got stopped, he somehow got his car started and fled the scene (of course).

Here's the damage:


[Image: crash3.JPG]

Here are the airbags that deployed (also notice the crease in the rocker = totaled) - the black strap with chrome snap just under the airbag on the right side of the pic is the seat belt loop I mentioned earlier.  Surprisingly, it didn't come unsnapped during the crash): 

[Image: crash1.JPG]

Rest assured, though - there's still a Camaro in the fleet.



[Image: carmen1.jpg]
I`m sorry mustang peps but that is a good lookin` car!    Thank God no one was killed or hurt?!! If we could only add airlocks to old cars LOL
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